Problem fitting LP lift pump Hungry Diesel kit

[monoblock]

I got the Hungry Diesel kit for the lift(transfer) pump upgrade for my 1993 .
http://www.thehungrydiesel.com/Low-Pres ... t-Pump.htm
I gladly paid the premium for the kit instead of buying the pieces separately to ensure it would fit and work well.It does not fit, nobody is home at Hungry Diesel when I called earlier and the truck is immobile for the weekend !Just hoping someone on this Forum knows the answer.
First problem:
1. No installation instructions -so it must be real easy?
2.No it ain't !I usually work on Porsche and Jaguar so tight/difficult/weird - I get that.
Larry B sells a stud kit .Now I know why.So after wasting time and busting knuckles trying to wrestle 2 gaskets,a spacer and the pump in place I gave up and went off to buy a local substitute for Larry B's longer studs.
Next suggestion -remove the driver's side wheel & work through the wheel well.Direct line of sight to the pump -very helpful.
3.Wow -almost an hour in Friday afternoon Los Angeles traffic & a couple of bucks for two studs and it is sooooo easy to fit !Come on Eric ,include them in the kit !

transfer pump assembled.jpg

4.Final problem that I need help on :- the pump is not even snugged up on the nuts ,yet the outlet fitting is already hard up against the engine block. There is a large lip on the block that partially overhangs the outlet port on the top of the pump.It is impossible to fit the fuel line to the top of the pump. The offending fitting is in the lower left corner of the photo.The upper fitting is for the incoming fuel line
What to do? Installation Instructions would help here but we've covered that issue.
SO 1st Gen's brightest minds are invited to write the instructions for Eric to cover this kinda basic issue I hope?
The options are :
1.rip out the pump and go back to stock - after wasting many unpleasant hours chasing studs and trying to fit the pump.
2.Grind/hack whatever that lip is until the pump does fit.This will require damage to the truck and multiple fit/try/refit attempts .What is behind that lip anyway?
3. your alternative suggestions.
Not how I had hoped to spend the weekend - so very grateful for any helpful suggestions from the Forum.I really need this truck back on the road.

[cmann250]

I installed a piston pump before Eric offered the kit and I ran into the same issue.

I think the lip that is in your way is the plastic insulation over the tappet cover. If I had light, I'd take a pic of how I cut the insulation out of the way.

[RCCUMMINS89]

Monoblock - sincerest apologies, I just got back out of the emergency room (son cracked a front tooth in half). Then I accidentally deleted your message.

The lift pump kit REQUIRES TRIMMING SOME OF THE INSULATION THAT RUNS DOWN THE BLOCK. Apologies, I had thought we had discusses this specifically over the phone. However, I mentioned it in our emails.... I just double checked.

Insulation instructions here: Our wonderful Moderator is AWESOME!!!!

http://www.dieseltruckresource.com/dev/ ... 93722.html

[monoblock]

"Eric,
Thanks for your reply.I have already cut the splash shield -no rain here!"
Yes Eric you did mention 'insulation' and I thought you mean't the splash shield that obstructs access from beneath.Hence my email reply to you quoted above.
O.K. I have betrayed 1st Gen and followed your link to the dark side.Great write up by a Forum member there,I will pm him my thanks. It would have helped enormously if this had been linked on the receipt/packing list -anywhere!
No cutting of insulation would be required if we use 2 spacers(or a much thicker one) + a longer plunger ???- and 100mm studs! Do you have these parts? Does anyone else have them -before I try to complete this (literally ) hack job ?

So here is some more helpful stuff so others have a more positive experience than I have had.
The 2 studs you need (worked for me) are M8 x1.25 x 40mm long YEMV. The original 10mm head bolts are 25mm long.Don't worry about the studs penetrating the block -they are blind holes.50mm length would have been better,60mm O.K..
Here is a photo of the mess you get into w/o the longer plunger+thicker spacer.You can't fit the fuel line to the new pump.

Overhang of insulation.jpg

Thanks for your help and sorry about the dental emergency.

[RCCUMMINS89]

A longer plunger rod doesn't exist, and therefore one would need to machine one. Are you able to do such a "feat"?

And my apologies that "tappet cover insulation" was not a good description of what needed trimmed.

[bgilbert]

Let me first say, I don't own one of RCC's lift pump kits. But this is not a problem inherent to his kit. It is standard operating procedure to remove the noise insulation cover over the tappet cover to fit a piston lift pump.

[monoblock]

No problem with the kit. No problem to turn up a longer plunger. It is just machine work.
Problem would be eliminated by the simplest of Instructions .None provided.
Over on the dark side link there are 9 pages on this install. Many of the points I mention are discussed.So this is not new .
One very important warning offered in the link and not yet mentioned here.I am so glad I read all 9 pages:
DO NOT GRIND/HACK the insulation ! There is a specific warning there about hitting a return fuel line . Another item for the Instructions for the kit .Per Diesel Truck Resource- a specific helpful suggestion is to use a (dull?) box cutter/knife.
Just trying to avoid any other Forum member having all this needless hassle.

[RCCUMMINS89]

I apologize that there were no installation instructions on the kit.... I will gladly return the kit if you'd like to.

[DodgeFreak]

Here's the thing.....This isn't rocket science to install the kit....I have not installed Erics kit but I put one together of my own and used bolts not studs and had no problems putting it together....you shouldn't need instructions to put it together....where was the cam lobe when you installed the pump?? Facing out where you had to compress the plunger??

[monoblock]

My objective ,as I stated at the outset was to help other Forum members with this project. The link to a competing Forum for Instructions written by a Competing Forum Admin was a surprise & a little late ....but helpful.I am grateful.
If it was so easy- why not just add the link to the Order acknowledgement for the KIT?
Studs -Larry B sells them for this specific purpose. Perhaps both he and I are ........? The cost of the studs was trivial,the convenience priceless.The time to get them....Part of the difficulty was the pump was hitting the insulation .......In Engineering, studs are usually preferable to bolts anyway.Ask a Mech Eng.
One detail on the studs: The double gasket may compress a little more after the initial fitting so allow a couple of heat cycles before the final torque down of the 13mm nuts(thin wall socket fits easily). If you are conscientious, add some Loctite 290 to the exposed ends of the threads. When it is dry you can protect the thread ends from rust by daubing with any gasket sealer or sticky red grease.
Anyway back to the objective I have added several other minor helpful(?) photos and suggestions in prior posts which I hope will be others can use.
I checked and indeed there are significant items lurking beneath the insulation over the tappet cover. So be careful as noted previously. It would be irresponsible of me not to mention this.
The other issue is that the piston pump projects much further from the engine block than the stock diaphragm pump. This causes the supply line to the new pump to abrade against the chassis and adjacent brake lines. Easily dealt with but a potential safety/inconvenience issue that I'd be irresponsible not to mention. Some hose insulation like that used on some of the adjacent cables/pipes would work well.
Oh and if you are fitting the fuel heater delete bushing/nipple -you'll need an 8mm Allen wrench.
I hope this helps others on the 1st gen Forum with this fuel pump replacement kit.
My thanks and gratitude to those who helped me today.

[monoblock]

I've been asked for more of the gruesome details for this job. I was trying to forget about it but here are some answers that I hope will help.
1. Remove Insulation?I used a cheap, small saw-tooth rotary blade from a Harbor Freight kit on a very weak Dremel tool. The cheap metal of the blade was unlikely to damage the parts beneath the insulation.I fitted the blade backwards. It creates a huge amount of dust ,so cover up the hole in the block to the camshaft that drives the pump.The reason for using a weak old Dremel tool is that it stalls if you hit anything other than insulation.You need two steady hands on the tool to avoid collateral damage.
2.Stud size ? The studs were from a local Fastener place -just regular M8 1.25 40mm ,50mm would be much better-just take the old bolts in to match the thread.See my earlier posts about the length.And make sure the nuts are hex size 13mm .If you get larger size,it will give tool access problems.Remember the Loctite 290 when you have re-torqued!
3. Remove 'ear' on bracket?To remove the obstructing ear on the bracket I used a weak Dremel tool with a small diameter ,thin, abrasive cut-off wheel(HF again). Cut between the existing holes.Then use Vise grips to bend it back and forth until it snaps off. Don't hit the FSS or anything else! You need a steady hand for this because it would be easy to cause collateral damage.You need to cut it as low as you can or you'll have to grind more off to give access to the FSS.
4, I did not have the special 24mm crowfoot ring/flare tool. I used a variety of Vise grips after soaking the FSS a couple of times with Kroil/PB Blaster.It was hack mechanics all the way.

[ellis93]

[quoteI checked and indeed there are significant items lurking beneath the insulation over the tappet cover. So be careful as noted previously. It would be irresponsible of me not to mention this.][/quote]

What are you talking about?

[PToombs]

The tappet cover must be, it's the only thing under there!

[RCCUMMINS89]

I probably shouldn't say this, but.... If I may? How is trimming the insulation this humungous "hack job", yet cutting the bracket in half on the injection pump (which isn't needed to be removed in order to remove the fss) not a hack job?

[DodgeFreak]

Does the p pump 12valves have the insulation??? I'm just going to remove it on mine when I transplant the engine.