Building the Tranny

How they work, how they don't work, and how to fix them

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Building the Tranny

Postby IowaCummins » Mon Oct 25, 2010 12:55 am

So this winter or when ever she lets loose i am going to be building the tranny. she has done great for me so far but, just not putting the power to the ground as much as i want. so as much as i want a manual im just going to build this 46rh and see how she does. What i do with the truck is mostly daily driver, tow or haul 5k once or twice a week. At times i tow in upwards of 15k but not more than 5 times a summer. i plow a little bit in the winter just for personal use and some light commercial. i have never pulled the truck due to afraid of dropping the tranny, but would like to pull a few times a year. i mostly race the truck on the 1/8 mile or occasionally on the street. but mostly i like to have a fast old truck that doesnt take crap from newer prettier trucks. :D

Parts list
what do you guys recommend? im looking to be at 400 horse if not more. but as of now i am only limited due to tranny.
money wise im thinkin if i need it to hold the power i will get it but if i can get the same strength out of a cheaper part im all for it. And yes i do know that it takes money to put power to the ground so im ready for the price.

Where should i start with this?
Torque converter- Spec rite, Gorends, and other company that builds a good TC?
clutches? red altos, kolene steels?
planetary? upgrade or no?
valve body- Gorends, Suncoast, - Full manual or retain auto?
other parts that need upgraded?

I am open to all comments and opinions i am just wanting to get a parts list rollin so when i decide to start buying parts i know what to get. also if i could get the names of places to purchase this stuff that would be great too.
Thanks Steve
1993 Dodge W250 Reg cab. Auto, .010" headgasket, A1 Studs. Just the Lil Ole VE pump Fuelin 7x.014's turnin the Aurora 3000 turbo. 5" Turbo back to Duals. :cbadge:
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby IowaCummins » Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:12 pm

guys that have built there own autos what did you guys use?
1993 Dodge W250 Reg cab. Auto, .010" headgasket, A1 Studs. Just the Lil Ole VE pump Fuelin 7x.014's turnin the Aurora 3000 turbo. 5" Turbo back to Duals. :cbadge:
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby ellis93 » Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:08 pm

I'd deff get better planets. Valve bodies can be moded with shift kits ( transgo is what I use ). The clutches I use mostly are highenergy with new steels. Never built one with the altos. Kevlar bands are a must. The apply levers are a good thing to buy just not the biggest( higher ratio) cause they are slower to apply. Far as converters I don't know. In something that pulls I get the tightest I can find cause less slip= less heat. I've only built for customers so u know they are picky when payin $ and only have had one come back out of the ones I've done. It was from a dang cooler line that poped off and dumped the fluid.
93 D250 ,5 speed,4.11s,k&n autometer tach pyro trans boost guages,GDS 60mm h1c 14cm,honed 5x10,hplp/reg,1/8 timing,M+H M2 fuel pin, tims cooler tubz
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby Ram360man » Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:40 pm

I used the Hughes converter in my sig. Looking back I wish I had spent a little more money and gotten a differant one. This one has a lot less slop but i'm just wondering if the spendy ones have less. You can feel and hear the shifts with it and it stalls around 1800. Sorry no tach just my guesstimation. I use the transgo shift kit in all of my transmissions. I use the Altos red eagle clutches and Kolene steels in both clutch packs. I also run the thinner forward clutches in the direct pack for a total of five. Kevlar low reverse band and a kevlar flex band for the kickdown. I run 5.0 levers in all of my transmissions and don't notice any overlap or slippage. I set the kickdown linkage fairly aggressive. It won't shift out of 2nd till you get over 35. I always put bolt in sprags in my 727s. I haven't had one let loose on me personally but have seen the damage it does and it scares the hell out of me. I'm running the stock 4 planet aluminums in my cummins and 3 planet in my 77 gasser. I haven't had any fail but i'm also not making that much umph. Sorry not sure if this helps at all. I've only built 727s and I'm just a dumb 19 year old. I don't know squat about the overdrive trannys besides their based off the 727. lol. :)
1989 W250. Maxed fuel pump. 5x14. 63/68/14. PS Intercooler. 4200 gov spring. 188/220 cam. Built 727
1989 W250 60mm gds. 2.5 inch crossover. turned up pump. Stock 727.
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby ellis93 » Wed Oct 27, 2010 6:44 am

Thought I'd list this. It is all I use. Transtar #s
Transgo TFOD-HD2 shiftkit
T22169B $120
Master o/h kit w/steels and highenergy clutchs
22006E $115
Thrust washer kit
22200E $25
Bushing kit includes all
22030BA $12
Front band kevlar
22022AK $10
Rear band
Solid 6" wide 22024A $12
Solid 6 1/4 wide 22024B $27
O/D planet kit 6 pinion. Retros all angled teeth
12580BCK $206
Rear 6 pinion planet kit
22584AA $130
Front 5 pinion planet kit. This really depends on what year trans you have cause of different intermediate shaft.
618 47Rh/e shaft 94 and up
22582E $140
518 46Rh/e shaft 93 and down
22582C same as above on money

And last but not least. A book. Because nobody knows every thing.
Tech manual 12400E $24

Hope this will help.
Last edited by ellis93 on Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
93 D250 ,5 speed,4.11s,k&n autometer tach pyro trans boost guages,GDS 60mm h1c 14cm,honed 5x10,hplp/reg,1/8 timing,M+H M2 fuel pin, tims cooler tubz
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby ellis93 » Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:03 am

Oh ya forgot this. Those planets are steel exept for the interm one. Late is steel early one is alum.
93 D250 ,5 speed,4.11s,k&n autometer tach pyro trans boost guages,GDS 60mm h1c 14cm,honed 5x10,hplp/reg,1/8 timing,M+H M2 fuel pin, tims cooler tubz
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby diesel freak01 » Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:04 am

ellis how much did all that set you back? i really want to upgrade my 93 but im always afaid of prices and also have no idea what i need to order.
1993 d350 ctd drw 2wd auto
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby ellis93 » Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:36 am

The price changs for me. Commercial account with transtar. I will say I did a buddies for around 1800. That was those parts and a tight billit converter (transtar that went out in 3500 miles). Don't buy there performance converters. In my opinion they are not worth it. I think that converter was 700 by itself.

Posted up the prices that I get from them. At least you all know about what it cost to build one when someone wants better that 2000 dollars for it.
93 D250 ,5 speed,4.11s,k&n autometer tach pyro trans boost guages,GDS 60mm h1c 14cm,honed 5x10,hplp/reg,1/8 timing,M+H M2 fuel pin, tims cooler tubz
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby IowaCummins » Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:00 pm

hey thanks guys for letting me know what you have done. im thinking this tranny build might be comming sooner than expected cause i just took a ride in my truck for the first time in a month with some new upgrades such as Power stroke IC Tims Cooler Tubz and some 7x.014 injectors. all i can say is good bye tranny. this thing will build a insane amount of boost instantly. which is not the greatest lol.
1993 Dodge W250 Reg cab. Auto, .010" headgasket, A1 Studs. Just the Lil Ole VE pump Fuelin 7x.014's turnin the Aurora 3000 turbo. 5" Turbo back to Duals. :cbadge:
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby ellis93 » Thu Oct 28, 2010 4:06 pm

Might tighten up the detent cable a little to raise tv pressure. U may also tighten the bands in side also
93 D250 ,5 speed,4.11s,k&n autometer tach pyro trans boost guages,GDS 60mm h1c 14cm,honed 5x10,hplp/reg,1/8 timing,M+H M2 fuel pin, tims cooler tubz
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Re: Building the Tyranny

Postby BC847 » Mon Nov 01, 2010 8:25 am

@ ellis93

In your parts list: O/D planet kit 6 pinion. Retros all angled teeth 12580BCK $206

Be sure to check that the kit includes a new Sun and Ring gear. The reason is your diesel truck's trans uses straight-cut teeth. You'll discover that the straight-cut teeth (Spur) gear-sets are hard to come by new and VERY expensive if found.

Also, you may have found that 15* and 22* angled teeth are available. Go with the 15* gear-set.

Stock/OEM Sun-gear TOP, 15* Sun-Gear BOTTOM:

Image

Stock/OEM Spur OD Ring-gear.

Image

15* Ring-gear.

Image



You must upgrade to the 2nd Gen intermediate shaft if you want a 5 or 6 pinion front planet (the splines between the two are changed). Also be aware that if you go to a steel front planetary gear-set, you'll need to get an additional (not OEM in the A518) plastic sleeve-bushing that fits between the front planet carrier and it's associated Ring-gear. (The aluminum OEM planet doesn't need it, switching to a steel-to-steel interface of the two, requires it).

Image

Finally, be aware that the planetary gear-set thrust-washers became larger in diameter in the newer versions of this trans. You'll want to upgrade those as well but it's not critical.

In the following example, the front planet (as shown) has the newer, wider thrust-washer in place. Next to it is the front planet's rin-gear. You can see the foot-print of the OEM, narrower thrust-washer.

Image
David

1993 12mm VE Fueled W250 CC, Green
12.67 @ 103.35
Your basic farm truck ;)
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby ellis93 » Mon Nov 01, 2010 10:01 am

Yes sir its a complete kit. Ring,sun and planet assembly. I should have included that shaft and price. I did say something about it just never listed it. Brain fart I guess.
As far as gear pitch. I think the two that I've bought were 15s. Most of this is what I've learned the hard way and through a old school trans builder. I'm deff still learning.
93 D250 ,5 speed,4.11s,k&n autometer tach pyro trans boost guages,GDS 60mm h1c 14cm,honed 5x10,hplp/reg,1/8 timing,M+H M2 fuel pin, tims cooler tubz
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Re: Building the Tranny

Postby txs » Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:41 am

most ve pumped 6bts won't ever hurt the stock clutch steels, if the old ones aint burnt, reuse them and put the money elsewhere. I would use the 4.2 kickdown lever, and as many alloy band apply parts as you can afford (both bands). the bolt in over running clutch is another good upgrade. dont waste your money on a six pinion rear planet carrier, the 5 pinion steel front carrier is good, they can be resplined for the 93 and back intermediate shaft, a&a has them. i usually replace the kickdown band, the L&R band gets reused if the lining looks good, the L&R band does not get used nearly as much as the KD band. When you take off in drive the L&R band does not apply, most of the time the reverse function is the only use it gets. it does apply when you put the shifter in 1, but it doesn't have to brake its drum to a stop for first or reverse gear like the kickdown band does every time you hit second gear.
93 w250 6 speed 4" exhaust, caution, work truck, she's no beauty. building 1 ton dually 4x4, dana 80, 48rh, 205 Scratch the one ton, bought frt. dually 4x4 98 12 valve with the tiny rear doors. rides so much better than the 93.
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